Informational Interview, part III

Just back from round two of informational interviewing with the same group I visited earlier this week. Today's meeting with the other Co-director went awesome!

I initially emailed this group two weeks ago, saw one Co-director earlier this week, and visited the other director today. The director I met with on Tuesday was the politician side of the center, today I met with the policy/academic director today.

The center was in a bit of a crisis when I arrived (3 minutes early, versus the 10 minutes I did on Tuesday). The co-director didn't have much time with me. We kept exactly to the thirty minutes I had requested. [2 points for Leadfoot.]

Despite the flusteriness of everything, I immediately felt comfortable with her. Partially because I already knew the center was laid back and cool, also because I knew she was the "academic" side of the center. The interview felt like being in my advisor's office before Advisor is about to teach--the Director was multitasking the whole time, but also listening very well. It was entirely familiar. Also, early on in our conversation she asked me where I was originally from. Coincidentally, she did an advanced degree in the city I grew up near. Our mutual love for HomeCity certainly didn't hurt anything.

She jumped right in with me, asking me about what I do, why I was visiting her, how I found out about them, etc. As a result, my carefully crafted intro went out the window, but all the prep I did with that was still good because I was able to quickly, and, mostly to the point, answer her questions. She asked if I had a resume with me. [Leadfoot totally had a resume! 5 points.]

I gave her my "policy" resume. I had my CV with me but it was clear that she only had time to read one page. Having now spent some time cleaning up both, I must say that resumes are way cooler. Why would anyone want to read seven pages about the stupid classes I've taught or all the dinky on-campus grants I've received, unless they were looking for a teacher or a grant writer? Resumes are to the point.

She asked a lot of questions about my dissertation research--what was my hypothesis, how did I do the research, did I have comparison sites, etc. Some of her questions were asking for more information and clarification--this indicated to me that I need to revise my resume to better explain that I really did live fulltime in Site for 12 months straight, and that I spent a lot of time hanging out with people on the ground. She said "being in the field" [i.e. talking to lots of different regular folks] is a major asset that I should highlight.

She actually seemed a bit impressed with my one publication (which hasn't been published yet). She asked about the editor, what the collected volume was about, etc.

As she was going through my resume she asked when I would be graduating. I explained that even though I wouldn't graduate until December, I was moving to City in July and that I was trying to put feelers out now in preparation for that relocation. I also told her that because I have little interest in teaching undergrads, I wanted to use my knowledge of State and research skills to make real changes. She was down with that.

I told her I didn't want to teach undergrads because 1) it's the truth, but also because 2) she would know better than anyone else in Center that academia is not hiring and there are lots of PhDs looking for temp jobs to tide them over till the academic market stabilizes (hahaha, as if that will ever happen). I made sure to say that I had "little interest" since I would certainly take a center job that had a teaching the public component to it.

She said that I needed to hone my "political sense". When I asked her how I do that, or rather, how do I demonstrate that on an resume, she said that from here on out I need to talk about my academic work in terms of how it applies to the real world. I asked her if I should try working for state government--she nixed that idea immediately. "State has no money, they wouldn't be able to pay you". I'm still unsure how to demonstrate my political sense exactly, but perhaps I'll come up with some ideas.

In the end, she said that I should call Center when I move to City. She said that State needs critical thinkers who can do research and synthesize material--i.e. the brain drain has left the State in a complete crisis. She seemed optimistic that I would find something. In fact, she sort of hinted that maybe in the summer they would have a need for me (or at least would need some kind of help). Nothing was stated explicitly, but she say that the center was going to do a review of goals and projects soon and that they may be taking on more projects in the future. She asked when I was moving and what my availability might be.

So even if she was not thinking of me specifically, she did seem optimistic that I might find something.

Lessons learned from this informational interview:

-Be ready to be interviewed. Although I wanted to ask questions about breaking into policy, she asked most of the questions. Many were job interview-y.

-Be ready to talk about dissertation/research in nontechnical terms. I definitely flubbed this and totally did the rambling grad student bit. Keep it succinct and brief. This is one of the cards I need work on. (At some Career Services talk I learned about developing answers to about 20 different common interview questions-- answers should cover all information within 30 seconds, or the amount of space you have on a 3x5 index card).

-Coincidences get you far. Our love for HomeCity was a definite plus. She almost went into anthropology/sociology but didn't--me being an ethnographer instead of a statistician was actually an asset for once. At the end of our interview she also told me that she was once offered a tenure tracked job at my PhD institution. We talked about Collegetown and the departments she would have hired into. She said that sometimes she wonders what would have happened if she had taken that job.

Overall, the informational interview went very well. I will definitely send her an email as soon as school is done to remind her I'm still around. In fact, even if absolutely nothing pans out from this week of interviewing, I think I can still contact folks at Center and ask for recommendations/help once I move to City. And, even though Director is way too busy to mentor me, I think she might be willing to let me shadow her or tag along to a few meetings/events.

Upshot of this week of informational interviewing? Informational interviews are awesome.

Informational Interview, part II

Just back from the informational interview I scheduled last week. It went well and I'm feeling better now that I actually did it and didn't have a total meltdown.

First things first. Here's the email text I finally sent:

Dear Associate Director:
I read Center's recent publication "Publication" and have found it incredibly timely as I finish writing my dissertation on social changes in Fieldsite. I am a graduate student in cultural anthropology and upon graduating I hope to find a policy job where I can practically use my knowledge of small city transitions in the industrial Region. I'm not officially job hunting yet; I simply would welcome the opportunity to talk with you about how one breaks into policy work.

Would you be willing to meet with me for thirty minutes to discuss how you got started in policy and State government? I'd appreciate any advice you can offer. I will be in City Date-Date and can meet in your office if that is most convenient for you. Alternatively, if you are unable to meet with me in person, I hope you would be willing to correspond with me by phone or email in the near future.

Many thanks for your time.

Sincere regards,

Leadfoot

signature line

Associate director replied 3.5 days later with a very nice email saying she would be out of town but recommended I speak with Co-director. She CC'ed Co-director on the email. After a bit of back and forth with Co-director on meeting logistics, we were set.

Now, contra to what a lot of websites and handouts say regarding informational interviews, I contacted Center and arranged everything via email. I did not do a followup phone call (i.e. "I will call next week to schedule a mutually agreeable time to meet"). I don't know about you, but I don't like to talk on the phone. And most people I deal with at my hourly Press job and in my academic life seem to prefer email. You get to it when you can, it's archiveable, it's searchable, and you get a lot of information about the person just from their signature line, etc. Unless there is a compelling reason not to, I will continue contacting people for info interviews via email.

Day before my info interview I did a walk-by of the office so I knew where it was and I added their general office number to my notes, in case my bus caught fire, or there was a freak snowstorm, or an impromptu parade, or something else that prevented me from arriving on time.

I read through their website, read the publications they had published recently (and had pdf'ed on their site), I became their fan on facebook, I did a little googling on the Co-director I was meeting, etc. I fixed my grant writing resume and what I think might go on a policy center resume (both I made up as I went along) and fixed my CV. I wanted to be prepared.

I wrote out my self-introduction and edited it. [I did this so I could refer to it if I totally froze, but also because I do better if I write it out once]. I complied my questions, bolding the ones I absolutely wanted to cover. At the bottom of my questions sheet, I wrote out key terms the center uses and some VIPs we might know in common. Like I said, I was going into over prepared mode.

Which I am glad I did.

I arrived about 10 minutes early and Co-director saw me almost immediately. [Note to self, arrive only 5 minutes early]. We talked about 40 minutes, then he introduced me to two peeps who have jobs I want. All said and done, I was there about 55 minutes. So 25 minutes more than I said. Oops. Must get better at directing conversation and sticking to established time.

Co-director was a friendly guy. Talkative and jokey. Also skeptical of academia and told me so straight off the bat. Well, actually he told me after I introduced myself as a "PhD candidate in the department of anthropology at the University of blahblah". Note to self. Locate myself in simpler, less pretentious sounding terms.

I told him I wanted to know how to break into policy and research work, but didn't really know how, so I thought it would be best to go straight to the source. I told him, "to better help you answer my questions, maybe I should briefly introduce myself." I told him in two (layman's terms) sentences what my research is about and mentioned that on top of my 5 years of researching in Site, I did undergrad at a university just down the way from his hometown. I told him that "I want to use my experiences as a grant writer, researcher and writer to practically make change and that a research policy center seems to be a good place for me". I told him that I was moving to City in July and that my partner currently works in City for Well-known Organization.

[I told him about my personal life and Honey's job because I wanted to indicate that I had longterm ties to the State, current ties to City, and was obviously planning on being in City for a while. I'm glad I did because later in the convo he and I talked about the budget cuts Honey is seeing at Organization and how things have changed for State in the last decade.]

Below are the questions on my cheatsheet. The bolded questions are the ones I absolutely wanted to cover, the starred ones were the ones I was actually able to ask or Co-director addressed in our conversation.

What is research and policy work like?

**How does one break into these fields, especially in State?

What is a typical day like for you at Center?

What is a typical career path into this kind of organization?

**What is the best way to enter this field?

**What kind of experiences would you encourage or expect for anyone seeking a career in this field?

What skills or talents are most essential to be effective in your job?

**What is the best way to get the skills or experiences that would best qualify me for this kind of job?

**What entry level jobs are best for learning as much as possible about this field?

**How should someone with my lack of policy experience approach prospective employers?

Are there websites or publications that might help me learn more about policy and research work?

Are you aware of job boards, websites, etc. that focus on policy and research work in State?

**Who else should I contact in City? May I use your name?

Overall, I give myself a B. I flubbed my self-intro and ran over on time. But I was personable and got many of my questions covered.

I'm to email the other Co-director who is kind of the head of this center and has ties to another dream job center. Co-director today says other Co-director might give me other insights and pointers, especially as a former academic. Score!

Here's what I will do differently next time:

--Buy a watch battery and remember my women's watch (which is currently sitting dead at my apartment). I had to wear Honey's runner's watch since I didn't want to check my phone for the time. I look appropriately professional, minus the hardcore men's timex dragging down my arm.

--Get new business cards asap!! My are all pretentious and I've hated this batch from the start. They currently say

Leadfoot, MA

PhD Candidate

school address, etc.

I will be getting some that simply say

Leadfoot

Graduate Student

school address, etc

--Get real thank you cards. I've sent my email thank yous to the Co-director and the two peeps I met today. By tomorrow I need to also send a paper thank you; I'm planning on addressing it to the entire office.

So that's my informational interview. Off now to make notes on the specifics and start contacting the various folks Co-director and peeps recommended. Hopefully I'll have informational interviews in the future!

Informational Interview, part I

I've been gone for a while. Sorry! Dissertation chapters, crying snowflakes, and real life have been claiming my attention these past few weeks.

Tonight as I was finally reading an email from mid-February I found my new dream job. A nonprofit policy center in my research State. It has ties to Brookings Institute, which has long been another dream job.

Next week is Spring Break. I will be spending the whole week in the very city this center is located in. I will be moving to said City this summer and living there until I get a real job. In other words, I would be a complete idiot not to do an informational interview.

Okay, so I've been trying to figure out this whole alt-academic job search thing for a bit. And I'll say right here, I have no idea what an informational interview is. Okay, I kinda know what they are. And in fact I did one in November. But they are still complete mysteries to me. [after writing this I realized how lame an excuse this is. Fear should not equal inaction. Here's an awesome step-by-step, sample questions and reminder to write a thank you note, more questions and discussion about length of query letter]

So although I hate to practice informational interviewing with this totally awesome sounding policy center, I'm going to.

Here's the basic rules I know about informational interviews.

Do not ask for a job.

The Bible claims that this is the #1 unspoken rule about informational interviews. My question is how many people outside of college career centers actually know what I'm asking for when I request an informational interview. Whatever, even if they don't know career center lingo, we can clearly explain--"I'm not looking for a job yet, I'm just trying to gather information about this field."

Keep it to 30 minutes. Or less.

The Bible says this. My fieldwork experiences with busy, VIP, mover and shaker people also confirms this.

Ask open ended questions about the interviewee's experiences.

Ethnography at its best! Here's some suggested questions from the Bible that I am totally going to use (if I get an interview).

-How did you get started in this field? (this field being nonprofit policy work in State)

-What does your typical day look like?

-What do you like most about this job? Are there things you dislike?

-What's the future outlook for policy/small centers/research programs in State?

-What skills are important to have in this field?

-What would you see as the best way to get the skills and experience to best qualify me for this kind of job?

-What do you suggest as the best way for someone with my experience to approach prospective employers?

-How should someone with my lack of experience approach prospective employers?

-Who might be a prospective employer?

-What makes resumes go to the top of the pile?

-Can you suggest any other people in City I should talk to?

Depending on the type of work, you might ask questions about the field more generally (there are some examples above).

This website is aimed for the $100K+ job seekers (ha, in my dreams) but it was recommended by Leaving Academia for its good job searching/job interviewing advice. I like the high roller's suggestion to have four or five insightful questions--that way you show you know how to do basic research. So for example, when I did some casual job searching among the academic publishers at my last conference, I asked how the financial situation was at X school and what kinds of web 2.0 programs they were implementing. I already knew from my hourly gig that most publishers are broke and that the future of publishing is electronic or perish. I got so much juicy good insider info because I demonstrated that I knew these were the two biggest concerns within academic publishing right now.

At my info interview I'll ask how to get into policy work. My "big picture question" will be how to get into the nonprofit scene in City.

I'm going to send my query email to the Associate Director because I think she will have the best info for me all around--she has ties to the state government, her background with economic development offices is closest to mine. Also she's responsible for day-to-day operations (perhaps that means hiring?), and is more likely to be in the office than the executive director.

Here's what my email is going to look like (pending final edits tomorrow).

Subject: Informational Interview

Dear Associate Director:

I read your recent publication XX and have found it incredibly timely as I finish writing my dissertation on social changes in Site. I am a graduate student in cultural anthropology and have been conducting research in Site for over five years. Upon graduating, I hope to find a policy job where I can practically use my knowledge of small cities in Region. I would welcome the opportunity to talk with you about how one breaks into policy work.

Would you be willing to meet with me for thirty minutes to discuss how you got started in policy and State government? I'd appreciate any advice you can offer--I'm not officially job hunting just yet. I will be in City March 21-27 and can meet in your office if that is most convenient for you.

Sincere regards,

Leadfoot.

signature line with my university info, etc.

Stay posted. I'll let you know what my final email looks like, what the response is, and (hopefully!!!) how the interview goes.